Hi Cathy,

thanks for your reply.
Concerning my ICX it is 6/2 Separation 2 with the conscious Sun in
Hexagram 5.
So my P. Sun is in an open Sacral Center and it doesn't shine by itself
whereas the P. Earth in Hexagram 35 is a hanging gate ( if I have understood
correctely the meaning of "hanging gate" ) in the defined Throat.
Design Sun/Earth (47 / 22) they are both part of defined channels.

Yours,
Michel

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cathy Kinnaird"
To: "michel schneider"
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 10:15 PM
Subject: RE: [HumanDesignPro] Unconscious definition

> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>
>
> Hi Ron, Don & Michel,
>
> Thanks for your discussions and observations. I would get an even deeper
> feel for your nature if I knew your Incarnation Cross. It would be
> interesting to see if your Sun/Earth conscious or unconscious were in
> defined or undefined centers. It might be powerful to know how it feels to
> be a reflector conscious and unconscious but with you Sun or Earth in a
> defined center and visa versa.
>
> In my chart, I am an emotional generator both in my Design chart and in my
> Personality chart. I have the channels 5/15, 10/57 and 39/55 at the
> personality level. I have the channels 46/29 and 37/40 on the design side.
> I
> haven't met many people with this emotional generator activation conscious
> and unconscious. I'd love to hear from others who might have this kind of
> configuration. Oh - my ICX is 4/6 Vessel of Love with the 10th Gate as my
> conscious Sun.
>
> I like this forum a lot. Thanks everyone.
>
> Cathy Kinnaird
>
> --
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.9 - Release Date: 5/12/2005
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can all
> be found at:
> http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
> _________________________________________________________________
> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and paste
> this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
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Hi wa,

yes, I will share my chart with you.
There is a certain amount of shyness I have to deal with, coming from the
second profile line and also from the second lines in my design which are
the majority but anyway, I 've slept over it and it seems to me that it is
ok.

My chart is also online :
http://humandesignonline.com/chart/Michael_Scheider_M.gif

We are born under the same cross, and also the
same day but in an other year.
What I've learned until now (a little bit more than three years since I
received my first reading) ,
is that the Incarnation Cross, at the beginning,
is not somewhat on which there is some "work to do".
The focus is not on the cross.
The only thing we can do is to begin with the experiment, or I could also
say : to watch if there is something inside us which
makes us begin the experimentation, and obviously, the only way to begin
is with our type, our strategy and our inner authority.
The living out of the cross is somewhat what comes after (maybe) as
consequence of
the application of our strategy and inner authority but there is nothing
else
we can do.

Concerning our conscious Sun in gate 5 in the open Sacral Center : this is a
sleeping gate,
which means that without interconnection with other energies coming from
outside, nothing happens.
Like I wrote in the other post, in this case the Sun doesn't shine by
itself, and for make it
shine there must be someone or a transit which gives us the 15 gate of
Modesty.
At that moment the gate of Waiting becomes consistent by forming a
definition ( in your
case even more consistent, because of
the two South Nodes in this gate) but this always will be conditioned from
what kind of energy we will absorb in the 15.
So for us it is important
who gives us the 15, but this is on the one side, because on the other side
that
doesn't mean that we have to spend our lives in yearning for the 15, nor in
yearning for all the other halves of channel we don't have in our chart.

Hope this helps,
all the best,
michel

----- Original Message -----
From: "walking angel"
To: "michel schneider"
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 9:39 PM
Subject: [HumanDesignPro] cross of separation - in projector and
manifestorcharts

> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>
>
> hi michel/
>
> I also have the cross of separation in my design, and I would like to
> explore the cross with you, if you're willing? I'm just beginning to
> develop an understanding of the significance of my cross in my design. So
> I'm intrigued by the possibility of seeing the cross in the context of a
> different design than my own - particularly a person of a different type -
> and exploring what's similar and what differs. Would you like to do this?
>
> I really would like to *see* our two designs. My chart is online at:
> .
>
> In words: my cross is 5/35 22/47, 5/1 profile. I'm a single split splenic
> projector with sixth line definition in the 'Brainwave' channel 57/20 and
> lots of spleen and throat gates. Not a motor in sight. I'm very interested
> to begin to understand how the same cross goes to work in, I quote: a
> "Triple Split 6/2 Emotional Manifestor... the only conscious channel is
> the 37/40, the other four are completely unconscious."
>
> My fifth-line personality sun (gate 5) is on an open sacral centre like
> yours, but 'trebled' with both first-line conscious and sixth-line
> unconscious definitions from my South Node. My fifth-line personality gate
> 35 is hanging on a defined throat, like yours; but again 'trebled' with
> both first-line conscious and sixth-line unconscious definitions from my
> North Node. Like you, my design 47 is in the defined, unconscious 47/64
> channel, but unlike you, my design 22 is first-line, on an open emotional
> centre.
>
> How to begin?... I'm very aware of my triple/mixed defined hanging 35,
> yearning for a 36. And my unconscious 22 yearning for a 12; both channnels
> make a manifestor of me. Recently I met both gates in the same person.
> Boy! On the other hand I tend to take my 47/64 very much for granted; it's
> always been central in my awareness of myself, even if it is unconscious.
> And my triple/mixed gate 5 is still rather a puzzle; the chart says that
> it has much more weight than I'm yet able to grasp, it's a bit of a
> mystery to me. There are other (unconscious) gates that I'm much more
> aware of. Actually what you said of your own personality sun may help me
> get closer to this: it's "in an open Sacral Center and it doesn't shine by
> itself."
>
> Your first posting was in the manifestor thread; so I wonder, how does the
> cross feel to you, in the context of your triple-split manifestor design?
> Without seeing your chart it's hard to tell, but it sounds as if you have
> more pure unconscious in your design than I do. For sure, you have more
> splits and more defined channels. My sense is, of a chart which looks more
> complex than my own; or rather, my complexity is in multiple and mixed
> definitions of fewer gates.
>
> Oh, not forgetting a small matter; that the world of a 6/2 and a 5/1
> are.... different!
>
> Would you like to share your chart?
>
> Best wishes
> On the wings of design
> /michael
> walking angel }wa{
>
> On 14 May 2005, at 12:30, Michel Schneider wrote:
>
>> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>>
>>
>> Hi Cathy,
>>
>> thanks for your reply.
>> Concerning my ICX it is 6/2 Separation 2 with the conscious Sun in
>> Hexagram 5.
>> So my P. Sun is in an open Sacral Center and it doesn't shine by itself
>> whereas the P. Earth in Hexagram 35 is a hanging gate ( if I have
>> understood
>> correctely the meaning of "hanging gate" ) in the defined Throat.
>> Design Sun/Earth (47 / 22) they are both part of defined channels.
>>
>> Yours,
>> Michel
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can all
> be found at:
> http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
> _________________________________________________________________
> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and paste
> this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
> http://lists.thefoco.com/mailman/options/humandesignpro/mschneider%40hum...

Hi Deborah,

for sure it is also a delight to read your comments.
What comes out for me in reading your message is the feeling that behind
what you write, there is a deep understanding of the HD.
Thank you.

Michel

----- Original Message -----
From: "Deborah Bergman"
To: "michel schneider"
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 2:41 AM
Subject: Re: [HumanDesignPro] cross of separation - in projector
andmanifestorcharts

> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>
>
>
> Hi separating, non sacral, fifth-gated beings:
>
> It is such a delight to see your designs naturally expressing themselves
> through your conversation,. Projectors knowing themselves through the
> other in the natural Projector fashion. The sensitive recognition of
> unspoken but demonstrated qualities (i.e. the shyness of the second
> line). Impact being impacted. The beautiful mystery of defined gates
> out of open centers. Myself disposing of the 5.5, conscious, arising
> from a defined sacral, I respectfully offer a sacral pebble into your
> open stream.
>
> 5th gate defined and Ritual: so beautiful! for a sacral being it can
> be felt the sacred embodiment of the cells, the predictable and ritual
> yet possibly very quiet and humble and unrecognized celebration of
> physically vibrating with life. If the Projector attends the ritual or
> the Manifestor sweeps through impacting it, the Generator, for instance,
> *is* it; feeling the joy of the cells in stillness and responding to its
> vibration in a predictable, patterned, rhythmic way while that Projector
> guides and recognizes the event. I have always felt you can hear or
> feel the sound of it in Jim Morrison's music (personality sun 5.5 emo
> mg, cross separation ) almost vibrating off his 29/46 sacral definition
> and up through his Prodigal throat; I like to think that's part of what
> drew people to The Doors: dark moody prodigal power also so spontaneously
> coded with still surrender to life. For me, too, not yearning for (more
> right-sided in the chart) but simply being the cellular hum of life.
> Yearning or not specified elsewhere in the chart.
>
> I would imagine that the Manifestor on this cross would necessarily
> impact with the same quality, particularly within a response field, which
> is what we of course arguably have here virtually whether generators are
> contributing verbally or not. We can be tricky that way. Also, all the
> gates swimming this gene pool anyway, generators or no. So maybe you can
> consider yourself virtually defined: your light is certainly getting
> around.
>
> Deborah Bergman
> 6/2 e mg dedication
>
> On May 16, 2005, at 0:12, Michel Schneider wrote:
>
>> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>>
>>
>> Hi wa,
>>
>> yes, I will share my chart with you.
>> There is a certain amount of shyness I have to deal with, coming from
>> the
>> second profile line and also from the second lines in my design which
>> are
>> the majority but anyway, I 've slept over it and it seems to me that it
>> is
>> ok.
>>
>> My chart is also online :
>> http://humandesignonline.com/chart/Michael_Scheider_M.gif
>>
>> We are born under the same cross, and also the
>> same day but in an other year.
>> What I've learned until now (a little bit more than three years since I
>> received my first reading) ,
>> is that the Incarnation Cross, at the beginning,
>> is not somewhat on which there is some "work to do".
>> The focus is not on the cross.
>> The only thing we can do is to begin with the experiment, or I could
>> also
>> say : to watch if there is something inside us which
>> makes us begin the experimentation, and obviously, the only way to
>> begin
>> is with our type, our strategy and our inner authority.
>> The living out of the cross is somewhat what comes after (maybe) as
>> consequence of
>> the application of our strategy and inner authority but there is nothing
>> else
>> we can do.
>>
>> Concerning our conscious Sun in gate 5 in the open Sacral Center : this
>> is a
>> sleeping gate,
>> which means that without interconnection with other energies coming from
>> outside, nothing happens.
>> Like I wrote in the other post, in this case the Sun doesn't shine by
>> itself, and for make it
>> shine there must be someone or a transit which gives us the 15 gate of
>> Modesty.
>> At that moment the gate of Waiting becomes consistent by forming a
>> definition ( in your
>> case even more consistent, because of
>> the two South Nodes in this gate) but this always will be conditioned
>> from
>> what kind of energy we will absorb in the 15.
>> So for us it is important
>> who gives us the 15, but this is on the one side, because on the other
>> side
>> that
>> doesn't mean that we have to spend our lives in yearning for the 15, nor
>> in
>> yearning for all the other halves of channel we don't have in our chart.
>>
>>
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> all the best,
>> michel
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "walking angel"
>>
>> To: "michel schneider"
>> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 9:39 PM
>> Subject: [HumanDesignPro] cross of separation - in projector and
>> manifestorcharts
>>
>>
>>> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>>>
>>>
>>> hi michel/
>>>
>>> I also have the cross of separation in my design, and I would like to
>>> explore the cross with you, if you're willing? I'm just beginning to
>>> develop an understanding of the significance of my cross in my design.
>>> So
>>> I'm intrigued by the possibility of seeing the cross in the context of
>>> a
>>> different design than my own - particularly a person of a different
>>> type -
>>> and exploring what's similar and what differs. Would you like to do
>>> this?
>>>
>>> I really would like to *see* our two designs. My chart is online at:
>>> .
>>>
>>> In words: my cross is 5/35 22/47, 5/1 profile. I'm a single split
>>> splenic
>>> projector with sixth line definition in the 'Brainwave' channel 57/20
>>> and
>>> lots of spleen and throat gates. Not a motor in sight. I'm very
>>> interested
>>> to begin to understand how the same cross goes to work in, I quote: a
>>> "Triple Split 6/2 Emotional Manifestor... the only conscious channel is
>>> the 37/40, the other four are completely unconscious."
>>>
>>> My fifth-line personality sun (gate 5) is on an open sacral centre like
>>> yours, but 'trebled' with both first-line conscious and sixth-line
>>> unconscious definitions from my South Node. My fifth-line personality
>>> gate
>>> 35 is hanging on a defined throat, like yours; but again 'trebled' with
>>> both first-line conscious and sixth-line unconscious definitions from
>>> my
>>> North Node. Like you, my design 47 is in the defined, unconscious 47/64
>>> channel, but unlike you, my design 22 is first-line, on an open
>>> emotional
>>> centre.
>>>
>>> How to begin?... I'm very aware of my triple/mixed defined hanging 35,
>>> yearning for a 36. And my unconscious 22 yearning for a 12; both
>>> channnels
>>> make a manifestor of me. Recently I met both gates in the same person.
>>> Boy! On the other hand I tend to take my 47/64 very much for granted;
>>> it's
>>> always been central in my awareness of myself, even if it is
>>> unconscious.
>>> And my triple/mixed gate 5 is still rather a puzzle; the chart says
>>> that
>>> it has much more weight than I'm yet able to grasp, it's a bit of a
>>> mystery to me. There are other (unconscious) gates that I'm much more
>>> aware of. Actually what you said of your own personality sun may help
>>> me
>>> get closer to this: it's "in an open Sacral Center and it doesn't shine
>>> by
>>> itself."
>>>
>>> Your first posting was in the manifestor thread; so I wonder, how does
>>> the
>>> cross feel to you, in the context of your triple-split manifestor
>>> design?
>>> Without seeing your chart it's hard to tell, but it sounds as if you
>>> have
>>> more pure unconscious in your design than I do. For sure, you have more
>>> splits and more defined channels. My sense is, of a chart which looks
>>> more
>>> complex than my own; or rather, my complexity is in multiple and mixed
>>> definitions of fewer gates.
>>>
>>> Oh, not forgetting a small matter; that the world of a 6/2 and a 5/1
>>> are.... different!
>>>
>>> Would you like to share your chart?
>>>
>>> Best wishes
>>> On the wings of design
>>> /michael
>>> walking angel }wa{
>>>
>>> On 14 May 2005, at 12:30, Michel Schneider wrote:
>>>
>>>> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Cathy,
>>>>
>>>> thanks for your reply.
>>>> Concerning my ICX it is 6/2 Separation 2 with the conscious Sun in
>>>> Hexagram 5.
>>>> So my P. Sun is in an open Sacral Center and it doesn't shine by
>>>> itself
>>>> whereas the P. Earth in Hexagram 35 is a hanging gate ( if I have
>>>> understood
>>>> correctely the meaning of "hanging gate" ) in the defined Throat.
>>>> Design Sun/Earth (47 / 22) they are both part of defined channels.
>>>>
>>>> Yours,
>>>> Michel
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can
>>> all
>>> be found at:
>>> http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and
>>> paste
>>> this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
>>> http://lists.thefoco.com/mailman/options/humandesignpro/
>>> mschneider%40humandesignsys.ch
>>
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can
>> all be found at:
>> http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and paste
>> this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
>> http://lists.thefoco.com/mailman/options/humandesignpro/
>> rubythroated%40comcast.net
>>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can all
> be found at:
> http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
> _________________________________________________________________
> To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and paste
> this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
> http://lists.thefoco.com/mailman/options/humandesignpro/mschneider%40hum...

Michael (and everyone on this group),
Thanks for sharing so openly! My 2 year old son is a Reflector with the 5th
gate in his design 4 times!! And, it's in his cross, the Rt. Angle Cross of
Consciousness (64/63, 35/5). I know it is significant that its in his cross
and so many times in his design. I have just thought of it up until now as
a need for structure, routine. So, I much appreciate the additional
insight.

Warmly,
Pam (spenic Projector 2/4) "If we did all the things we are
capable of, we would literally astound ourselves." Thomas Edison

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-----Original Message-----
From: walking angel [mailto:walking.angel@mac.com]
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 11:06 AM
To: pam@aiminghigher.com
Subject: [HumanDesignPro] gate 5

(Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)

Greetings deborah/

Thank you for the ripple, ripple, ripple of your sacral pebble,
respectfully proferred and graciously received. I'm so glad that
'ritual' resonates. Your evocation of cells, vibrating with life,
humming, enriches my feeling for my 5 (which vibrates in lines 1, 5 and
6). I *like* my 5! This is perhaps as well, since it's my cross and
triple-defined ;-) It's great, also, to have your gloss on the Types
and their differing participation in the ritual. Thanks for this.

Learning that Jim Morrison has the same cross as me (and Michel) gives
me pause for thought (feeling, I mean). Twenty-five years ago I wrote a
book whose first chapter opened with: "People are strange when you're a
stranger, faces seem ugly when you're alone. Women seem wicked when
you're unwanted, streets are uneven when you're down. When you're
strange, faces come out of the rain, when you're strange..." I haven't
thought about my relationship with that lyric and that mood for a long
time, maybe it's time to revisit? At the time I used the quote it was
about depression, alienation and the sullen resentment of a middle
management cog in Capitalist wheel, feeling damaged and dangerous and
wanting to manifest. The Doors were a perfect sound track. Probably,
now, it's about being a projector, waiting without having learned to
wait. Jim didn't learn the waiting stuff, did he?

Regarding the Prodigal, and Jim Morrison's brooding vocals... Having
half a Prodigal myself (the throat end; it's the part of me that wrote
the book) I can't quite resonate with that; gate 33 doesn't feel dark
to me. For me the quality of Jim Morrison's voice is more like... if
there was a movie of the graphic-novel character Swamp Thing (half man,
half mangrove tree), Jim Morrison's vocals would be the sound track.
Cellular, green, primordial, throbbing and monstrously rooting and
branching, down and dirty and insubordinate, echoing and rumbling in
the lowest steamiest muddiest most-primaeval register of the fifth
gate.

Well maybe not :-) Just playing! Let me know if I'm offending your
sense of the beauty of the Gate of Rhythm. On the other hand, Richard
Rudd's highlighting of the Shadows of the hexagrams shouldn't be
neglected? Sloth, he says about gate 5; and impatience. Not nice,
especially sloth.

Once more, thanks Deborah
Love
/michael
}walking.angel{

On 17 May 2005, at 01:41, Deborah Bergman wrote:

> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>
> Hi separating, non sacral, fifth-gated beings:
>
> It is such a delight to see your designs naturally expressing
> themselves through your conversation,. Projectors knowing themselves
> through the other in the natural Projector fashion. The sensitive
> recognition of unspoken but demonstrated qualities (i.e. the shyness
> of the second line). Impact being impacted. The beautiful mystery of
> defined gates out of open centers. Myself disposing of the 5.5,
> conscious, arising from a defined sacral, I respectfully offer a
> sacral pebble into your open stream.
>
> 5th gate defined and Ritual: so beautiful! for a sacral being it
> can be felt the sacred embodiment of the cells, the predictable and
> ritual yet possibly very quiet and humble and unrecognized celebration
> of physically vibrating with life. If the Projector attends the
> ritual or the Manifestor sweeps through impacting it, the Generator,
> for instance, *is* it; feeling the joy of the cells in stillness and
> responding to its vibration in a predictable, patterned, rhythmic way
> while that Projector guides and recognizes the event. I have always
> felt you can hear or feel the sound of it in Jim Morrison's music
> (personality sun 5.5 emo mg, cross separation ) almost vibrating off
> his 29/46 sacral definition and up through his Prodigal throat; I like
> to think that's part of what drew people to The Doors: dark moody
> prodigal power also so spontaneously coded with still surrender to
> life. For me, too, not yearning for (more right-sided in the chart)
> but simply being the cellular hum of life. Yearning or not specified
> elsewhere in the chart.
>
> I would imagine that the Manifestor on this cross would necessarily
> impact with the same quality, particularly within a response field,
> which is what we of course arguably have here virtually whether
> generators are contributing verbally or not. We can be tricky that
> way. Also, all the gates swimming this gene pool anyway, generators
> or no. So maybe you can consider yourself virtually defined: your
> light is certainly getting around.
>
> Deborah Bergman
> 6/2 e mg dedication

_________________________________________________________________
The Live class link, Email Group Archives, and Live Class Archives can all
be found at:
http://www.humandesignonline.com/p/live-pro-forum/index.htm
_________________________________________________________________
To unsubscribe or modify your subscription options, please cut and paste
this ENTIRE link into a web browser:
http://lists.thefoco.com/mailman/options/humandesignpro/pam%40aiminghigher.c
om

Hi michael,

il n'y a pas de quoi (in English it might be somewhat like: nothing to
thank).
Or, from another perspective, I could say that it's me who thanks you for
have remembered me that I am a hermit.
While writing my previous message, out of my not-clarity in the now, I was
aware of the shyness of the second line, but not of the fact that the second
line also wants to be left alone and also that in this phase I am on the
roof.

Concerning our conscious Sun in the 5th gate, and the "ritual feeling"
rather than habit, I would say that for me it works more in the direction of
the habit.
When I was twenty and someone would have told me that I have to follow fixed
patterns and habits, I would have answered that they're speaking to the
wrong person, it's not me.
Now I see that yes, it's ok to go every morning to drink coffee
almost always in the same place and reading always the same newspaper [ok,
now there is a part of me saying that this shows that I've become
an old man :-) ] .

About the learning to wait which is challenging you ...... for me it's the
same.
Also if I am a Manifestor I have to wait the emotional clarity, then I have
to inform, and then I can act.
But what an impact the 5th gate of Waiting, sleeping in an undefined Sacral
center can have or not in the application of my strategy, for now this not
clear to me.

Yours,
michel

----- Original Message -----
From: "walking angel"
To: "michel schneider"
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: [HumanDesignPro] cross of separation - in projector
andmanifestorcharts

> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>
>
> hi michel/
>
> Many thanks. I hadn't properly appreciated what I was asking of you as a
> hermit. So special thanks for feeling your way to sharing your chart.
>
> Yes, it really helps me to see our two charts side by side. The crosses
> vanish into the background, and what stands out is the quite different
> gestalt of a manifestor and projector chart. Motors, no motors, throat
> connection. Splenic authority, emotional authority. This serves to
> underline what you wrote - and others are stressing to me too: "the only
> way to begin is with our type, our strategy and our inner authority". For
> myself I'm feeling very challenged by learning to wait; but it's in my
> projector strategy and it's in my cross (gate 5 line 5) so... yes, this is
> where the learning lies.
>
> Thanks also for your discussion of the gate 5. In myself I find that this
> gate isn't 'yearning' or fidgetting (it's the sexy, potential manifesting
> channels where this happens). I have a very clear and stable sense of
> pattern, and myself as a patterner. Maybe this is partly the multiple
> definitions in my 5? I sense that this comes also from the 18, 48 and 47,
> 'pattern' gates which are all on defined centres. But I'm beginning to see
> that there is a particular sense of patterning - something like Ritual
> rather than habit (this echoes the I Ching perspective on the 5th
> hexagram: Attending at the Sacrifice) - which by definition, perhaps, only
> is available in association with others. I sense that this is the mode of
> my gate 5 which waits for the right 15. And - with an undefined Self - I
> guess that the right person will only be found in the right place (which
> will be the place where the ritual is called for). Do you, by any chance,
> have a similar 'ritual' feeling about your sixth-line gate 5?
>
> Once again, thank you for sharing. And thanks for highlighting 'the right
> #15'.
> My best
> /michael
>
> On 16 May 2005, at 08:12, Michel Schneider wrote:
>
>> (Replying to this email will send your message to everyone)
>>
>> Hi wa,
>>
>> yes, I will share my chart with you.
>> There is a certain amount of shyness I have to deal with, coming from the
>> second profile line and also from the second lines in my design which are
>> the majority but anyway, I 've slept over it and it seems to me that it
>> is
>> ok.
>>
>> My chart is also online :
>> http://humandesignonline.com/chart/Michael_Scheider_M.gif
>>
>> We are born under the same cross, and also the
>> same day but in an other year.
>> What I've learned until now (a little bit more than three years since I
>> received my first reading) ,
>> is that the Incarnation Cross, at the beginning,
>> is not somewhat on which there is some "work to do".
>> The focus is not on the cross.
>> The only thing we can do is to begin with the experiment, or I could also
>> say : to watch if there is something inside us which
>> makes us begin the experimentation, and obviously, the only way to begin
>> is with our type, our strategy and our inner authority.
>> The living out of the cross is somewhat what comes after (maybe) as
>> consequence of
>> the application of our strategy and inner authority but there is nothing
>> else
>> we can do.
>>
>> Concerning our conscious Sun in gate 5 in the open Sacral Center : this
>> is a
>> sleeping gate,
>> which means that without interconnection with other energies coming from
>> outside, nothing happens.
>> Like I wrote in the other post, in this case the Sun doesn't shine by
>> itself, and for make it
>> shine there must be someone or a transit which gives us the 15 gate of
>> Modesty.
>> At that moment the gate of Waiting becomes consistent by forming a
>> definition ( in your
>> case even more consistent, because of
>> the two South Nodes in this gate) but this always will be conditioned
>> from
>> what kind of energy we will absorb in the 15.
>> So for us it is important
>> who gives us the 15, but this is on the one side, because on the other
>> side
>> that
>> doesn't mean that we have to spend our lives in yearning for the 15, nor
>> in
>> yearning for all the other halves of channel we don't have in our chart.
>>
>>
>> Hope this helps,
>> all the best,
>> michel
>
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Hello Cathy,

Thanks for wading in here. My incarnation Cross is the RAX of Rulership 2


(45/26  22/47)  Only the 26 is in an undefined center. I hadn't
looked at

it this way before and have only recently become aware of the 70% related


to the Cross. I have so far given particularly my personality Sun the
short

end of the stick, because it was not part of a defined channel, but more
so

because of my discomfort with the implications of the 45 relative to how


I've been conditioned. I think I'm addressing what you're speaking of. If


you want to look farther:

June 8, 1946

3:21 AM

Portland, Or. USA


Blessings,

Ron


At 01:15 PM 5/13/2005, you wrote:

(Replying to this email will
send your message to everyone)




Hi Ron, Don & Michel,


Thanks for your discussions and observations. I would get an even
deeper

feel for your nature if I knew your Incarnation Cross. It would be

interesting to see if your Sun/Earth conscious or unconscious were
in

defined or undefined centers. It might be powerful to know how it feels
to

be a reflector conscious and unconscious but with you Sun or Earth in
a

defined center and visa versa.


In my chart, I am an emotional generator both in my Design chart and in
my

Personality chart. I have the channels 5/15, 10/57 and 39/55 at the

personality level. I have the channels 46/29 and 37/40 on the design
side. I

haven't met many people with this emotional generator activation
conscious

and unconscious. I'd love to hear from others who might have this kind
of

configuration. Oh - my ICX is 4/6 Vessel of Love with the 10th Gate as
my

conscious Sun.


I like this forum a lot. Thanks everyone.


Cathy Kinnaird

Re: [HumanDesignPro] Unconscious definition

Much appreciation to you unconsciously defined folks, your observations helped me with some realizations about my chart. Here are my insights, for what they’re worth.



I’m a 5/1 E. MG, cons. Sun in Gate 11 of otherwise empty Ajna, LAX of Education.  Personality chart is a Reflector, Design a Projector with only the Prodigal defined.  I have spent my life pretty quietly, despite everyone’s high expectations.  I can’t bear being in the projection field (would love to hear more about this!), I tend to hide in corners and feel frustrated because I’m not educating people.  Now I am seeing activations besides the 5 profile that would make me shy — Gate 12, Gate 44.6 (Aloofness).  With five active gates on the Throat I am dying to manifest, and I have a talent for zeroing in on someone’s essence or fundamental whatever, and articulating it coherently, but I don’t have reliable access to this ability.  It only pops out in response to the right situation.



What I have realized from contemplating all this is that my salvation is not to have expectations and to learn to love WAITING!



Cheers,

Becky