If im a salesman what day would be the best for me to sell my products.
Is it better when the money channel is active.
If my coworker have this channel is that good or does they need to have
a difined ego as well.

Best regards

Daniel John

Hey

Thanks for the clarifying explanation. I get what you're saying now.

I think the reason why I'm not fully getting the thing about desires and wants and needs, is because I'm not 'there' yet.

Also in my (defined, hehe!) mind there's a clear distinction between wanting something and needing to worry about it.

Dunno, this will get clearer for me as I keep playing around with HD.

For now, I know that I will probably always have moments when I feel I can't survive (open spleen, heart, G); I've noticed that just knowing that it's my mind trying to get me to do something to soothe that fear (which is obviosly not my strategy) is a tremendous relief.

Being a MG is really a blessing for me, because whenever I get into this fear mode (and if you look at my emotional center you will know what i mean ;-), I just take out my projects-list and see what I respond to. I really don't have to make an effort to get going. Ijust get instantly happy doing stuff. I'm also blessed in that I have a couple of people (coincidentally it's the ones who assigned me those projects) who are all perfect guides for me - I had their charts read!).

Again, thanks for clarifying. I enjoyed our little interaction here immensely :)

Hi

I can't really respond to you, because I'm not clear about the points you are making.

Couple of things to clarify what I understand from what you are saying:

1. >>>Heidi, I think there is definately something wrong with wanting money. I have no problem with getting money or having it as long as I let it happen, as a result of being correct. It really doesn't matter if it's lots of money or not. Because you have no choice. <<<

- So, if you are saying that it's our attachment to what we want that's causing the trouble, I cannot agree with you more.
- It's up to everyone, as far as I'm concerned, to consider wanting whatever as wrong or right. Personally, it doesn't serve me to judge, blame something that I can't help. I don't know about you guys, but I just find myself wanting stuff, food water shelter and money to pay for it. And, I pretty darn well am not going to blame myself or others for it either.
- what i DO about it and how ... now THAT is another story; that's where the HD strategy comes in very handy, provided I have the guts to even hear my response, let alone follow it.

2. I'm not sure where you got the idea that I'm an expert at HD. I'm not teaching it, making money off of it or anything else. Would be nice if I did ;-), but I'm not there yet. Not in this lifetime. Like most of the rest of us, I'm just doing the best I know how to learn and experiment and share my experience. I've had some exhilarating ones that filled me joy and hope. Other than that, what I'm sharing is my experience the way I understand it so that it may encourage others to try HD as well. I am definitely not on a crusade; anyone is free to suffer more, no problem!
- I may be misunderstanding (my bias, sorry), but I don't feel that there is a HD aristocracy or something. Actually, the brief exchanges I had with people who really REALLY know what they are doing (like RA for example) were totally warm and supportive. He didn't make me feel like a sub-species because I'm just beginning to grasp HD. On the contrary.
- So, I'm sorry to say, I have a deep yucki reaction when you generalize and judge me and others (God knows based on what assumptions) and based on blaming whatever circumstances and people you had in your life.
- That is ok. Blame and anger feel better than helplessness and surrender. Question is : does it further you or does it keep you stuck in resisting what's really going on?

3. Granted, people should've told you and educated you. Truth is, they didn't. All that means is that they were ... well, I can't find another word than 'not-selfs in action', which is what most of us are anyways (in varying degrees).

4. The problem with understanding or not understanding HD is that it's the wrong question, at least for me. It doesn't help anyone one bit.
What helps is surrendering to the experience in the hope that it'll all get clear one day.

And, let me just end with this: I'm really sorry for the bad circumstances you had in your life. But, I wouldn't go so far as to colapse issues, money-bad, no money - virtuous. Whatever makes you happy!

All my best to you

I don't mean to offend you but things like that make me cringe.

It seems that you know a lot about HD. I don't. I only started a couple of weeks ago to go deeper, but what you are suggesting seems to put a lot of wrong things in people's heads. As if they don't have enough of that already!
To me, the title is exactly what HD ISN'T about.

I think the ONLY one trying to make money is YOU by publishing such a book. And yes you are 'using' Human Design, but certainly not APPLYING it. If you know what I mean.

This is my first day on this forum and I already start making enemies! :shock: Gulp

Again, if your motivation is to make money I don't want you as my teacher. If you would enter into such a thing correct you would not worry about money, because everything that you need will come to you.

When we make “Money Course” last year in international Ibiza event with Ra it was clear that people spend a lot of money through the not self. Many people wing a lot of money through their not self, and causes infelicity in his self and others.

Design knowledge allows you to be you. You can not buy you with money and you can fill very rich if you have enough to live another day.

Well, live your design. If there is in your design to wing and manage a lot of money, do it through your true self not through your not self. It could be better for everyone.

I'm a split definition projector with a 63-4 64-47 48-16

WHAT a delight to finally be justified in my TOTAL inability to keep appointments without tremendous physical and emotional stress.
You bring up a really interesting idea about how to work, make dough, with this design. I am a fine-art painter, so I did manage to jump that hurdle, but it was imperative for me to work by/for myself doing something I could do at any moment... To take your concern a step further - I was one of those kids who had strong brain stuff - both logic, and abstract, but was a failure in school because I could NOT get to class on time, or sometimes not at all, nor do homework, luckily I had parents who didn't think school was the end-all. It's hard on us though to still have to keep certain appointments, though I have gotten to the point where people know that I'll either get there when I get there - or won't come at all. And yes! for me it is very much like a hex - if I say I'll be there, I will have 40 other, more interesting things going on. So I feel that for our design, we must be our own bosses, or have ones that are enlightened to our time-frames. I never understood why my bosses couldn't just deal with the fact I was late every day..............................!!!

And your comments about the effects on the body really resonate with me.
My father got a horrible disease, and I am CERTAIN he had an undefined ego that was forced to work on the clock. My feeling in the last "regular" job I managed to do for a while was that I was DYING from it. I not only was under completely disproportionate stress from keeping someone else's hours, but emotionally I felt like I was withering away sitting in that chair, I would go into deep and chronic depressions.
Certain days I would walk in, turn around, walk out to a phone, call my boss and say I was not well enough to be there, and it was true... I amazed everyone with my seemingly selfish intent to insist I was unable to do what so many people do without thinking, or at least without feeling like they are dying from it.

And then to have a double 46 makes me say YES to everything.....
ouch.

I'm finally grooving with great a group of friends that get me - love me but are never hurt when I don't show up.
My family still gets hurt sometimes, and I have to let a lot of their emotions roll off me without guilt - as I am feeling what they feel!!!!!! What a life.

Thank you Ra wherever you are...

I didn't know Ra did a workshop on making money from HD. I can't understand the concept at all. I totally stand by my earlier post that making money becomes irrelevant as we learn to be our true selves because while we are not fully our true self we live in lack (lack of self) and it wouldn't matter how much money we made, we'd still feel poor/emptyat some level or fragment of our being.

I am totally convinced, however, by your last post, as so let me say: my experience of using my HD design to make money is that I am letting go of my addiction to overcommitment, that I am learning patience, that I am learning to perceive an invitation to engage in life from my true self and to give a yes or no from my inner authority. That means I have stopped trying to force or manipulate myself to do things for the sake of making money. I have pulled my energy out of the healing centre I was in because it became clear to me that I was pushing myself rather than being in the relaxed receptive state I have begun to recognise as my true creative being, and I have not proceeded to train as an analyst because I am blocked at every turn - so I am waiting. (I succumbed and sent out a few feelers- I call them invitations to an invitation - and got nothing meaningful back!)

Meanwhile I am building my own perceptions of HD (I have 60/3), and the other modalities I'm using and coming up with some amazing mutations of each one. Divine timing, flow and creativity abound as I have followed my design, let go of my fear of not having enough money (conditioning in the 45 which is pretty much my only bridge to my throat) and life feels wonderful.

Oh, and I'm totally and completely broke - not a penny to my name and wondering how I will pay the rent AND provide christmas dinner for my kids.

in love, lightbeing

Good point Cynical Shaman,

I can see that my post was not specific enough. I do tend to read (and write) between the lines. My response is this: I believe that all we need to do is support people who wish to do so to live their design as fully as possible because in this way they will experience abundant living. As you so rightly point out, and as I was attempting to say myself, not everyone's design is about making or even desiring money.

And so, the short answer from me: how to achieve wealth and happiness from your design? - learn to live it. There aren't any tricks or techniques. They would only constitute an avoidance - a game by the not-self to deceive and confuse.

3: I don't have an undefined ego, but I can understand how that would be a puzzle and a paradox.

in love, lightbeing

PS. still know next to nothing about this third line thing.... anyone?

No. I disagree. I find that there is some eerie continuity between me and everything in the world. If I so much as hint that I will be somewhere, something always crops up. It is magic. Now that I know this, I may even consider trusting that if I am about to promise something, I can say I know that thing is impossible, or not meant to be. Scary. But that is my experience and also Ra's audio confirms that the very act of commitment creates strain and disease in the undefined ego.

No. But the third line theme reveals the way the hexagram links to material forms, as I understand it. Whatever line you have, the third line is relevent to understand the trial and error of that hexagram in relation to material form, and so to money. And the material connection of the electromagnetic (or harmonic) gate. And surely the aspects that may be excluded by your defined channels.

My point is that if you have an undefined ego, and commitments strain your health, and certainly will damage your wealth in the long run, then what ways do you find wealth without normal working hours for example. Is there anyone who has been there and done that, or read any biographies that are relevent to strengthen our specific understanding of this? Clearly art, music recording, poetry, writing are tailored to undefined egos. Performance is not, as it needs a commitment to time and place. 9 to 5 work is out, as an undefined ego can lead to heart and digestive problems from the commitment to get out of bed in the morning. My Dad died of a heart attack, and I would not want anyone to lose a father or a friend through anything as stupid as working hours. I am sorry to sound brutal about the lives of so many ordinary people. But this is the theory of Human Design, and I think we need to discuss if it is rubbish or true before we talk about anyone changing careers.

Just take the Blue pill, Neo.

My God kip, your Saturn is so strong. Thank you for responding with your line 4, I wish you every respect and I can only presume that my gate of doubt (63) with mars (immature and selfish enthusiasm) in line 2 (externalisation, the hermit) is giving your gate 4 line 6 (trial and error, wisdom in later life) a rough time (Saturn).

Thank you for your stimulating post, if this reply is too strong, I will withdraw it.

Hi Digidoc, Interesting posts. I have Gate 4. My definition is 17-62, 10-20, 31-7. I also have Gate 16. Sacral - empty, ego - empty, spleen - empty, Crown - empty.

Undefined egos can make promises, but they find them hard to break. You don't need an ego to make money, or a 3rd line. Knowing HDS doesn't give us control over the world. There is no "way" to make money - if there were we'd all be rich. There are millions of ways to make money, that's why so many people have been able to do it. Some people don't try, some do. Some succeed, some fail. If you really want to make money then you either do whatever it takes for you to make it (maybe you succed, maybe not) or you wait for it to fall into your lap (maybe it does, maybe it doesn't).

Everybody is "living their design" - whether they know it or not. Most of us periodically live other's designs as well - whether we know it or not. Ain't life grand?

Thanks for the words of wisdom Gennaro. I also want to say the structure of the forum is improving, and I really appreciate the hard workl you put in for us all to have this resource.

My feeling is that we may want to provoke and mutate. And doubt and all these delicious aspects of being human. In know that you are the boss around here, and the official line is live your design follow your strategy.

Yes this is true. But sometimes it is annoying and just too difficult to grasp. I do not recommend always living your design. I recommend experimentation, and finding who you are, and what works for you. This is much broader and more enticing.

I also think that there is a lot of pressure on most people in today's world to make money. This leads to powerful conflicts with living your design. If you cannot make promises, and many of us have an undefined ego, we cannot, then is there a way to live in the normal workplace, and in the material world and so on?

These are challenging and vital discussions to have.

I want to open that debate, and this is a community process. I pose the questions, raise the doubts, I am gate 63. If you have gate 4, I invite you specifically to watch my postings and if you can, post or email a response. Every one of my white gates is a thirsty tongue and I say let me taste your experiences, let me hear, let me compare, and distill it into words for the minds of those who live in the mind.

The mechanics of human design mean that some people are destined to teach and most of us are not. I do not agree that the best way to make money is to sign up, that is sect talk, that is suspect, and my gate of doubt is flashing like a blue light. Am I living my design? Maybe, I cannot let my mind intrude to decide if I am or not. I choose health wealth and happiness. If I have those, I am OK, who wants to join me?

I myself am not here to become an analyst, to follow the standard path. I recognise that when I look back, others may say oh yes you did, that was exactly the standard path. That may be so. But today, with my eyes in this body, I see as I see, and I have deep sympathy for all the people coming to human design with doubts, with tears, with their own gardens and gravestones.

Maybe I am a little tricky. Maybe I say, let us catalogue human experiences and I will write a book based on facts rather than ideas, and we can all have more health wealth and happiness. And maybe you read the book, and there is only one conclusion at the end. Live your design.

That is exactly what Ra is doing. Come to this seminar and that, yes he needs to feed his family, and ultimately, if you can grasp Live Your Design right now, it would be much cheaper for you.

I have a tendency in my shadow (or not-self) to avoid facts and practicality. It is not easy for me to consider walking on coals. As it happens, I have good health, in most ways, more than adequate wealth, and many times of pure bliss. I see idiots who teach my children hatred and stupidity and I have to send them to school, there is not much alternative. I see my mother, unhappy through years of confusion and well meaning, and I think of my father and my first wife, both of whom died painful and untimely deaths because of the hypocrisy in society. I need to dance away from what could be bitterness. I want to soak in the sunshine of hope. So please do not discourage ordinary people who have no idea what the hell you are on about with "strategy". Ask yourself, Gennaro, would you be inclined to post after the boss has said, ah, Confucious he say, forrow yor stlatagy! Would you be happy to post if you thought, oh, some senior priest will just slap me down with that line.

I have no doubt, well gate 63, a containable amount of doubt, about the conclusion of the book, if I do write it. It will not need a conclusion, it will breathe from every page. Yes, it will almost certainly say in a thousand different ways, follow your strategy, this is what happened to Joe and Jack and Jill and so on. This is the theory. This is empirical observation. Statistically, following your design brings health wealth and joy. Almost certainly. But I will get there on my path, and it is not because I blindly accept the dogma. I am well placed to say, bring it on, let's fight out this theory using facts. Yes I want to find some crack in the paintwork. Some personal choice, we all do. And I am prepared to nail my charter to the noticeboard, strategy or not, it's mechanics anyway, anybody out there, you can RESPOND to this, your are INVITED to write something.

I do know that until I myself create my own fortune, as a homework excercise, using the third line strategies of my gates and the gravity of my own centres, I would not be qualified to write such a book.

Again I appeal for anecdotes. Together we can establish, scientifically, what overcomes suffering in this world. Empirically, by testament after testament.

I also want to hear from people who hate human design, they are the people with the passion to really attempt to disprove it, and if it is true, they will form the vanguard of a new paradigm. Sounds good eh? Parrot Time. The Van Guard of A New Parrot Time.

Sorry. There comes a point where words are so clumsy.

Please, everyone, dare to post personal trials and errors, and this forum has a purpose. This forum could be for individuals to express their individuality, and for a reference of real human experience.

Or it could be a place where whatever you try, there is always the "aha - he's not-self, she's not-self, I'm more self than you are..."

The only way to be self is to be unique.

Hi,
For me it depends from where you are asking the question. If you are asking it as somebody who is not living their design then the answer is easy: live your design. They may not get rich but they will be too busy having fun to care.

If you are asking it from the point of view of somebody who is living their design, then that is a diferent thing. Your life is correct and somehow your strategy led you to the point one day where you asked how to make more money. Then my answer would be: KEEP living your strategy. You may not make money but at least you'll get what you deserve.

Now, for the sake of the collective mental process, lets just say we wanted to know how to use Design to make money. I think the best way is to learn how to teach it to others. There are under 50 design teachers in the world and about 6 billion people who have never heard of design. That's a lot of students. Or get a license from Jovian for exclusive publishing rights in a country. I think Liberia is still available. Or hire a whole lot of people with third lines in their charts and pay them to make money for you. They will screw up once in a while but in the long run I think they'll make you rich.